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radioPaul Calvert spoke with Canon Andrew White
Continued from page 1
Andrew: It's not just an area like Iraq. How do you bring reconciliation to Palestine, Israel and Iraq? You bring it by loving, loving and loving. We work with all the various religious leaders, the Shia, Sunni, Yazidi and Mandaean, all of them. We have to show them the love of God and show them that if they hear each other's stories they will begin to love each other and if they see each other, they will see the love of Jesus in each other.
Paul: Is it about building relationships with people?
Andrew: Everything is about relationships, it's not what you know, it's who you know. Jesus says, "Love your enemy" and if you really do love your enemy, your enemy will begin to change.
Paul: Is it easy doing the work that you do?
Andrew: It is because it is all about love. Jesus says, "Love casts out all fear" and so in the natural it would be the most difficult thing in the world, but in reality it is the most wonderful thing in the world.
Paul: You recently tweeted that ISIS were 10 minutes out of the city, what was it like for you personally facing that?
Andrew: Well I have to be honest for you, it was like a normal day, "So what, they are coming, they might get you, but I'm not going until they make me go".
Paul: So you are not afraid of death or capture in these situations?
Andrew: Well one of my staff said to me, "You are not afraid of capture, you are not afraid of death, but do you know what they do when they kidnap you? That's not dying, it's a lot worse" and suddenly I realised that that wasn't so good.
Paul: How are Christians and Iraqis handling the stress of what is happening?
Andrew: They are handling it because they know the love of Jesus. One of our young people not long ago, they were from Voice of the Martyrs in America and they said to her, "Why is it that you are in the midst of disaster? Everything is awful and you are so happy?" She said, "When you have lost everything, Jesus is all you have got left". And so we have lost everything, but not Jesus.
Paul: Do you believe that God's angels have been protecting you?
Andrew: Have you seen how big they are? They are so big. People say, "Have you seen any angels?" I say, "Yes they are frightening. They are big. They are protecting me". They work overtime when I am there and sometimes I think what do they want for their overtime, but they are there.
Paul: Do you believe that prayer was the power behind Baghdad and you being safe recently when ISIS were 10 minutes outside the city?
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Andrew always manages to convey that it is only the Muslims, or only the Arabs, who need to see the light and to repent; but it is the Israelis who have their foot on the throat of the Palestinians and who every day take their land, take their water, take their dignity, take their hope and take their lives. Andrew knows this, but he won't say it because he doesn't want to offend his Israeli friends. And that does not make him a force for reconciliation. There is no shalom without justice.